I think it's pretty clear Biden won this one walking away. Palin didn't make any gut-wrenching gaffes but, on the other hand, she didn't answer half of the questions either. She just started reciting whatever talking points struck her fancy, sometimes stringing together a stunning series of non sequiters. By the end of the debate, I wanted to reach through my TV set and throttle her perky little cheerleader persona.

If this election comes down to personalities, I think voters will prefer the two guys who obviously have functioning brains and have exhibited calm in the face of crisis, as opposed to the angry old man and the mentally challenged cheerleader. If not, I'm heading for Canada.

Ezra:

You highlight one of my key worries. That if the Republicans somehow can convince voters that they are for the regulation of the financial services and other industries, it will be just enough to convince voters that that issue is a moot point. And it will mean that any regulations will have more loopholes than you can imagine, and a false sense of security will come about, and no real action (preventative or punitive) will be be enacted.

We have 4 weeks, and the nasty adds are coming. I worry that there is a false sense of security, and, many of the undecideds or recently committed voters are actually opposite of the CW. They are waiting for a reason to still vote Republican.

Palin was confident, on-message, and at times, sharp.

American politics kills the palate. There was no there there. She knows nothing. She can bullshit to the high heavens, but she clearly knows nothing. The Graun's liveblogger said this:

A few final thoughts, having consumed more punditry: might Palin's reference to having been in the job for only about five weeks have been a bad miscalculation? CNN's voter focus group seemed to think so. Palin meant it as a boast, of course -- but there's outsiderhood, and then there's outsiderhood.

While British observers aren't the best barometers of the American mood, if there's really a majority of voters who value Hey-Diddly-Aw-Shucks-You-Betcha over basic fucking competence, then America's fucked already and there's nothing this election will do about it other than confirm the fact. I don't think that's the case.

I was at work and could only watch pieces of the debate. But the parts I saw had Biden doing Exactly what he had to, nothing more.

Im certain that in the backrooms where he practiced his debates there were many long hours standing there with Barack in the audience. Im certain Biden exploded in outrage at the outright idiocy of debating this woman. ..each time I can just picture Barack calming him down and reassuring him that his election was going to be won in the long run, not in a fiery moment. This whole campaign is about being the tortoise, and letting the hare scream and wail the whole way to the finish.

When Palin was practically lecturing Biden on setting up negotiations with foreign leaders I so wanted Biden to be able to say "So exactly what experience do you have dealing with international negotiations at a federal level. Because you see I .. .. .. "

..But he couldnt. IT wa all about maintaining a level head, staying on point, never falling into her little coached gotcha moments. He did it beautifully, like a professional.

True .. she didnt go down in flames which was entirely possible for her to do. Im certain however that it wasnt Bidens job to force that on her either. You could see it in his easy smile the whole time. He wasnt there to make a play, he was there to make his 1 debate a steady piece of the campaign's advance.

..Nice job Biden. That was almost as beautiful as it was painful to see that woman share the stage with you.

Masterful job by Biden. Just phenomenal. He had a very difficult task and he knocked it out of the park.

Palin did well too, grading on a curve. Well enough that if Biden had been off his game, the story line coming out of tonight would have been that he got beat by the rookie. But he was not only on his game, he was playing out of his head.

Almost without exception, his tone was pitch-perfect, his message succinct and effective. He came off as having nothing but respect for Palin (a study in contrast to McCain's contemptuous attitude last week), but he wasn't overly deferential, which would have come off as condescending, I think.

Basically the guy had to thread the needle, and he did. Bravo.

He won. I agree with Sullivan that in the beginning he was very wobbly and dry. It seemed like the gameplan was to sit back and watch Palin unravel, and Biden was just supposed to be as reserved as possible and avoid angry rants or gaffes. Towards the end he got his bearings and Palin ran out of coherent talking points.

Biden's job was to stick to the subject, focus on promoting Obama, and not lose the debate by coming down too hard on Palin.

Palin's job was simply not to lose too badly and do any more damage to the McCain campaign.

Both did their jobs well, and both campaigns got what they wanted: absolutely no chance that the networks will be playing any embarrassing clips on an infinite loop over the course of the weekend.

no chance that the networks will be playing any embarrassing clips on an infinite loop over the course of the weekend.

I take that back. I forgot about Palin's winking. I suspect we'll see some mockery of that.

"The stumbling, tongue-tied, intellectually uncertain novice who withered before Katie Couric's steady questioning was absent this evening. Palin was confident, on-message, and at times, sharp."

Uh, respectfully no. She was incoherent, unable to connect thoughts to sentences and just repeating memorized lines that she brought up no matter what the question.

I worry about wonks like Ezra who watched this and couldn't see the forest for Palin's smirking, winking demeanor. That's what people will recall.

Biden cleaned her clock.

@christian
..from your mouth to God's ear.

Unfortunately I think EK has seen a few too many contests where the current GOP has used their empty debating tactics + $ + spin to trick the public into thinking they've won when they clearly didnt.

Sadly, Ezra and his young gen are the ones most easily swayed by ad "branding....

Palin: "You might not like my answers, hell sometimes I might just be talking - to hell with answers, I'm new and don't know a lot. This guy plucked me out of thin air. Let's talk about energy"

Who won?

I am so tired of talking heads telling viewers what it is viewers want to see. All of their text messages from democrats, republicans and independents - as if they have the phone that connects to average joe.

Bush Republicans like John McCain and the "dudes" wife have nothing to offer. They don't pretend to offer anything other than a safe and prosperous America, steering completely clear of their own agendas which could easily be revealed for having no chance in hell to meet each vague promise.

"The stumbling, tongue-tied, intellectually uncertain novice who withered before Katie Couric's steady questioning was absent this evening"

Actually not really. Because this wasn't a real political debate, the moderator either was afraid to or not allowed to ask followup questions, and let her repeat talking points that in some cases had no relation to the question.

Katie asked actual followup questions like you'd expect at a real debate but didn't happen here. If she actually had to answer follow up questions we'd have seen the dazed confused deer in the headlights palin like we saw when real journalists were allowed to ask follow up questions. There was no steady questioning at all just one question. The moderator might as well have been machine repeating questions. No thought or curiosity or skill needed after the question was answered, unlike other presidential or vp debates.

No one's talking about how weak, unprepared and incompetent palin was that the mccain team thought she was unable to deal with followup questions that most of us would expect at a debate like this. Talk about the bigotry of low expectations.

Have a look at the analysis I performed of the words used by Palin and Biden in tonight's debate. Just as for the 1st debate, I produced "bubble graphs" showing length and number of words and sentences and "word clouds" displaying which words were used more by each debater. You can find it all at my Word Face-Off blog.

Have a look at the analysis I performed of the words used by Palin and Biden in tonight's debate. Just as for the 1st debate, I produced "bubble graphs" showing length and number of words and sentences and "word clouds" displaying which words were used more by each debater. You can find it all at my Word Face-Off blog.

Biden simply is good at lying his ass off with a straight face. He totally lied repreatedly during the debate, which many people will discover in the coming days. What I found most disturbing is Biden didn't even know our Constitution:

Biden said: "Article I of the Constitution defines the role of the Vice President of the United States. That's the executive. He works in the executive branch. He should understand that. Everyone should understand that.
And the primary role of the Vice President of the United States of America is to support the President of the United States of America. Give that President his or her best judgment when sought and as the Vice President to preside over the senate only in a time when in fact there is a tie vote. The constitution is explicit, the only authority the Vice President has from a legislative standpoint is to vote only when there is a tie vote. He has no authority relative to the Congress. The idea that he's a part of the legislative branch is a bizarre notion invented by Cheney to aggrandize the power of the unitary executive..and look where it's gotten us.""

JOE, THAT'S CRAZY TALK, Biden is just plain wrong about this. First of all, Article I defines the LEGISLATIVE Branch, including its composition and the scope of its powers and the powers and privileges of its members. Article I, sec. 3, clause 4 is the first time the Vice President is mentioned in the Constitution. It gives the Vice President an important role to play:

The Vice President of the United States shall be President of the Senate, but shall have no Vote, unless they be equally divided.
The Constitution goes on to direct the Senate to chose a President pro tempore to preside over the Senate in the VP's absence. The VP is also the President of the Senate during all trials of impeachments other than trials of the President. In other words, when Biden says that the VP has "no authority relative to the Congress" the truth is actually that the VP has a special authority, reserved to no other unless the VP chooses to let another wield it.

In addition, Article II does not extend to the VP any executive powers. Sections 2 and 3 specifically grant duties and powers to the President; the VP goes unmentioned. In fact, Article II provides for compensation for the President, but doesn't direct the VP to receive anything!

So Joe Biden is talking out his ass when he says "Article I of the Constitution defines the executive role of the VP. Article I doesn't define the VP's executive roles. In fact, neither does Article II, because the VP has no role to play within the executive branch except to take over in case of death or incapacitation of the President.

THE FACT BIDEN FLUBBED OUR CONSTITUTION WITH SUCH EASE IS PRETTY TELLING THAT THE MAN HAS NO INNER CORE CHARACTER THAT KEEPS HIS FROM BRAZENLY LYING TO THE COUNTRY.

No wonder he could so easily not just adopt Neil Kinnocks words, but adopt Kinnocks actual life story that was factually not his own.

Here's Biden lying about meeting with Achmadenijadh....NOTICE IN THE YOUTUBE DEBATE ACHMADENIJADH FACE APPEARS ON THE SCREEN AS THE 'LEADER' OF IRAN.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipLT6tUu3uE&eurl=http://wizbangblog.com/content/2008/10/02/biden-misrepresents-obamas-pledge-to-meet-iran.php

Question: "Would you be willing to meet separately without precondition in the first year of your administration, in Washington or anywhere else, with the leaders of Iran Syria, Venezuela, Cuba and North Korea in order to bridge the gap that exists between our countries?"

Obama: "I WOULD."

Here was Biden on coal plants when he thought noone was listening except some ditzy voter:

BIDEN: "We’re not supporting clean coal,” Biden responded, “China’s going to burn 300 years of bad coal unless we figure out how to clean their coal up, because it’s going to ruin your lungs, and there’s nothing we can do about it. No coal plants here in America. Build ’em, if they’re gonna build ’em, over there and make ’em clean because they’re killing you""

Colorado power is 75% produce by Coal plants. No wonder Joe Biden says Joe Biden is a liar....

I think the idea Biden cleaned her clock is, um, questionable. I think at best it was a draw, and I'd give a slight edge to Palin, just based on expectations. However, Biden was good, and the polls don't lie (hah!).

Still, I'm not sure how productive the debate was. It seemed mostly like an exchange of talking points.

"i am not sure how productive the debate was."

i cant imagine that it could have been more productive.
the comparisons between biden's extraordinary preparedness for this job at the most critical time in our history, and sarah palin's complete lack of preparedness and knowledge were crystal clear last night.
aside from his preparedness, biden showed himself as a man of honesty, disciplined restraint, wisdom and sensitivity...while she showed herself to be greatly lacking in all of those qualities.
the choice is clear.
it is up to the people of the united states, at this critical time, to make the decision on what they want.

(may G-d help us.)

The third time Palin accused Biden of "pointing fingers at the past insteada the forward-looking maverick reforms Americans want," I started hearing an improbably repurposed soundtrack:

Don't stop thinking about tomorrow...
(Yesterday's gone, yesterday's gone)

Humphrey's 1968 run against/with an incumbent's record was painfully awkward, but it was sleek grace compared to this.

This is one of the funniest blog entries I've ever seen! You're seriously going to say Biden won on the basis of a cnn poll....? The same cnn poll that favored Obama by almost the same exact margin after his debate...? There seems to be A LOT of reasons the polls could end up that way that don't involve Biden winning. Especially, when anyone that watched the debate can tell that he lied and was wrong on most of the issues.

the comparisons between biden's extraordinary preparedness for this job at the most critical time in our history, and sarah palin's complete lack of preparedness and knowledge were crystal clear last night.

Boy, I gotta say, I just didn't see it that way. The result: pretty much everyone on the left thinks Biden one. Pretty much everybody on the right thinks Palin one.

Ergo: not particularly productive.

I meant "won", not "one". I have a bit of trouble with the homonym dyslexia.

Considering this was 2 of the most ignorant people in national politics featurning gaff a minute Joe Biden and no clue Sarah Palin, I was hoping for a funnier debate. I guess Gwen Eiffel did not do a good job.

What's your take on this, Palin on taxes (question 3:

"Patriotic is saying 'Government, you know, you're not always the solution, in fact, too often, you're the problem'."

Considering this was 2 of the most ignorant people in national politics featurning gaff a minute Joe Biden and no clue Sarah Palin, I was hoping for a funnier debate.

They are both two people for whom the structured nature of the debates and the time limits help them immensely by providing defined boundaries in which they can work. For Biden, this forces him to stay on message, say what he needs to say, and stop, without letting his mouth run free. For Palin, this means she can repeat the relevant soundbite she was supposed to memorize and not have to worry about followups that will press her on question she can't answer.

It's tempting to blame Ifill, but the rules of this debate were carefully negotiated by the two campaigns. They structured it in such a way specifically for the benefit of their candidates.

The result: pretty much everyone on the left thinks Biden [won]. Pretty much everybody on the right thinks Palin [won].

There are a certain category of people called "undecided voters" who may also have an opinion, and I suspect they were probably included in many polls taken after the debate, and it was their judgment which probably swing the debate in favor of Biden.

"Patriotic is saying 'Government, you know, you're not always the solution, in fact, too often, you're the problem'...

... except when it comes to earmarks for your small town. Then the federal government is totally the solution! [wink]"

If Biden is so sure Ahmedinejad is not the big power in Iran, he knows more than the experts. Biden says it's the mullahs. Like which one? The regime is considered by Iran scholars to be extraordinarily opaque and here comes Biden with a simple answer. The fact is that no one here knows how much power A--nejad has or whether that amount is constant or shifting. But of course, she was unable to challenge him on that piece of baloney.

If Biden is so sure Ahmedinejad is not the big power in Iran, he knows more than the experts.

Please provide specific references to those Iran experts whom you claim disagree with Biden.

I think the idea Biden cleaned her clock is, um, questionable. I think at best it was a draw,

Come on Kevin. Allow yourself a moment of intellectual honesty. I know you like Palin, but this was not remotely a close call.

The only sense in which Biden did not win is the sense in which the two of them were not even competing.

Unbelievable.

The liberals and the Media were just salivating over the possiblility that Palin would make a fool of herself.

That didn't happen, and now they are saying that she simply spouted talking points...

What exactly does Obama do that is so different?

Palin may be inexperienced, but she is not running for the top job, Obama is.

http://samvak.tripod.com/personalitydisorders21.html

Projection
We all have an image of how we "should be". Freud called it the "Ego Ideal". But sometimes we experience emotions and drives or have personal qualities which don't sit well with this idealized construct. Projection is when we attribute to others these unacceptable, discomfiting, and ill-fitting feelings and traits that we possess. This way we disown these discordant features and secure the right to criticize and chastise others for having or displaying them. When entire collectives (nations, groups, organizations, firms) project, Freud calls it the Narcissism of Small Differences.

If Biden is so sure Ahmedinejad is not the big power in Iran, he knows more than the experts. Biden says it's the mullahs. Like which one? The regime is considered by Iran scholars to be extraordinarily opaque and here comes Biden with a simple answer.

Iran may be opaque, but nobody thinks that Ahmadinejad has usurped the Mullahs. Let me say that again: nobody believes that Ahmadinejad is more powerful than Khamenei and the other Mullahs. (Rhetorical h/t to J. Biden.)

They don't call Khamenei the "Supreme Leader" for nothing. He's been in power for twenty years. Ahmadinejad won an election among candidates hand-picked by the Mullahs.

Of course Biden won the debate without question...just ask any liberal jounalist or talking head.

I mean if you think off shore drilling is a form of planet rape, and barring coal power plants is saving the planet and raising taxes is the patriotic thing to do of course your going to love Biden.

Biden is exactly what the Washington/New York journalist set love because they are just like him...thinking they have all the answers and can fix all the problems because they sat on their asses drinking lattes or Dewars pontificating about how to fix America.

Most of the country distains these types and know Washington is and has been a biggest part of the problem.

My sister went to journalism school for one main reason - she didn't want to report facts to the public - she wanted to change the world and fight injustice. Journalists have all decided to take sides and most people see it.

If Biden had actually spent a career trying to make a living out in the oil fields of Texas; or a manufacturing plant in the upper mid west, or ran a bisiness in Altanta for the past 30 years...he would be an entuirely different person.

But he is a career politician, and career liberal Democrats don't get re-elected teling people government is the problem.

Any one who thinks a guy with no other career, that has spent 40 years sitting in the Senate reading government reports and the NYT has any clue how the real world works is delusional.

Any one who thinks a guy with no other career, that has spent 40 years sitting in the Senate reading government reports and the NYT has any clue how the real world works is delusional.

I suppose McCain learned how the world really works. He knows how to succeed. First, be born to a high-profile daddy who will pull strings for you your whole life (a.k.a. the George W. Bush plan). Then, dump your wife for a rich girl and buy yourself a senate seat.

Let me guess: POW!

Anyone who saw last night's debate saw a few things that should stand out:

1. Palin came out swinging and instantly erased the pre-conceived notions that the media made sure we had implanted before the debate.

2. Biden countered nicely shortly after being obviously stunned by Palin's initial tenacity.

3. Both candidates presented their arguments respectfully and intelligently, and at times emotionally. THIS aspect of the debate is significant because in light of our contemporary tone of politics, Palin and Biden showed excitable pundits how to act with civility.

4. Moderator Gwen Ifill conducted a fair, albeit clever, debate.

5. In the end, it came down to what the average American saw from these two people; did they see earnestness and integrity, or did they see just another politician, at a dangerous time in our American history, when politicians are highly suspect. Do I need to mention Congress or Bush’s approval ratings?

In the end, they saw Joe Biden, a politician, give an admirable performance during the debate, who held his own, and scored points of his own. But a politician nevertheless.

And they saw Sarah Palin, the debate's obvious winner. Here’s the difference:

They saw a fiery, confident, and competent candidate defy the predictions about the failure you were supposed to see. They saw the real deal. We all saw a Washington outsider standing toe-to-toe with a Washington heavyweight, and if you were like me, especially during times like now, you delighted in watching her do her thing.

In the end, if you watched NBC, you saw a shaky Tom Brokaw make a point to refer to her as a "politician" directly after the debate. Because he knows what we saw – we saw Palin’s beaming personality; intelligence mixed with colloquialisms (“nucular”) and we heard her small town accent, (both of which will violently appall elitists everywhere) connect with countless average Americans who were watching. We didn’t see a politician up there, we saw the pit-bull that we were told about at the very first. If the slight slur in Brokaw’s words indicated how he felt about it, he didn't like it very much.

And really, in the end, I was left with an odd sort of feeling. In the end, I’d wished that Joe Biden and Sarah Palin were running for the Presidency instead of the two we have running now.

Anyone who saw last night's debate saw a few things that should stand out:

1. Palin came out swinging and instantly erased the pre-conceived notions that the media made sure we had implanted before the debate.

2. Biden countered nicely shortly after being obviously stunned by Palin's initial tenacity.

3. Both candidates presented their arguments respectfully and intelligently, and at times emotionally. THIS aspect of the debate is significant because in light of our contemporary tone of politics, Palin and Biden showed excitable pundits how to act with civility.

4. Moderator Gwen Ifill conducted a fair, albeit clever, debate.

5. In the end, it came down to what the average American saw from these two people; did they see earnestness and integrity, or did they see just another politician, at a dangerous time in our American history, when politicians are highly suspect. Do I need to mention Congress or Bush’s approval ratings?

In the end, they saw Joe Biden, a politician, give an admirable performance during the debate, who held his own, and scored points of his own. But a politician nevertheless.

And they saw Sarah Palin, the debate's obvious winner. Here’s the difference:

They saw a fiery, confident, and competent candidate defy the predictions about the failure you were supposed to see. They saw the real deal. We all saw a Washington outsider standing toe-to-toe with a Washington heavyweight, and if you were like me, especially during times like now, you delighted in watching her do her thing.

In the end, if you watched NBC, you saw a shaky Tom Brokaw make a point to refer to her as a "politician" directly after the debate. Because he knows what we saw – we saw Palin’s beaming personality; intelligence mixed with colloquialisms (“nucular”) and we heard her small town accent, (both of which will violently appall elitists everywhere) connect with countless average Americans who were watching. We didn’t see a politician up there, we saw the pit-bull that we were told about at the very first. If the slight slur in Brokaw’s words indicated how he felt about it, he didn't like it very much.

And really, in the end, I was left with an odd sort of feeling. In the end, I’d wished that Joe Biden and Sarah Palin were running for the Presidency instead of the two we have running now.

Palin proved that she could read from notecards on camera. She used to work on TV so we already knew that.

She still bungled facts and rambled on about nothing over and over again.

Epic fail for the savior of the GOP.

They saw a fiery, confident, and competent candidate defy the predictions about the failure you were supposed to see. They saw the real deal.

10 McCain points for you!

"I mean if you think off shore drilling is actually going to doing anything to solve our energy problems, and complaining about Chinese coal power plants is saving the planet and starting unnecessary wars is the patriotic thing to do of course you're going to love McCain and Palin.

McCain is exactly what the Washington/New York journalist set love because they are just like him...thinking they have all the answers and can fix all the problems because they sat on their asses drinking lattes or Dewars pontificating about how to fix America.

Most of the country disdains these types and know Washington is and has been a biggest part of the problem.

If McCain had actually spent a career trying to make a living out in the oil fields of Texas; or a manufacturing plant in the upper Midwest, or ran a business in Atlanta for the past 30 years...he would be an entirely different person.

But he is a career politician, and career Republicans get re-elected telling people government is the problem."

It doesn't matter what Sen Biden did. Since it's supposedly a close race, as long as Gov Palin didn't fall on her face, the Media is & will portray her as the *winner.*
They want the horserace, and their bosses want McCain.
You betcha! (wink, wink, scrunched nose)
It doesn't matter that Gov Palin lacks curiosity, knowledge, and acts like one of the girls on the old *Petticoat Junction* TV Show... it's what millions of Americans want - - *she's like us.*
Frightening, and we're the laughing stock of the World, but true.
I still don't think the Media will allow Sen Obama to win... judging by the spin I'm seeing, of how great Gov Palin did, on the Networks.

RE: Kevin Willis saying Biden "cleaned her clock."

Guess you've never seen a real fight, eh?

Palin acquitted herself in the debate, although a better actress such as Julianne Moore would have won the debate. Palin is just acting on a stage,this is a woman who states she is a businesswoman, yet she and her husband couldn't get a carwash in their hometown off the ground. McCain gave one of her best qualities as serving on the PTA, nowhere does the PTA do anything--local PTA's aren't even school boards, SHE IS SIMPLY OUT OF HER LEAGUE. If McCain/Palin backers want to delude theirselves with the idea that her "performance" last night got them back in the race, go ahead, let's just hope that we never actually have to see her in office.

Come on Kevin. Allow yourself a moment of intellectual honesty. I know you like Palin, but this was not remotely a close call.

I'm tellin' ya, Palin won it, from my perspective. I realize why she would not have won you over, but . . . I think she won, and most of the folks on the right-wing blogosphere think she won. Biden did a great job, but I prefered Palin. I'm sure it wasn't remotely close, for you, and I understand that. Apparently, undecideds were breaking for Biden, so the refs call it for your team.

I think the refs are blind. Blind, I tell ya!

Was Palin's performance enough to offset John McCain's own lackluster debate performance, the suspended campaign, and the other mixed-messages the McCain camp is sending out? No. Do I think McCain is likely to overwhelm the historical trends that point to a Democratic win this November? No.

Lots of good points on why the left side of the aisle sees Biden as the winner, and I get where your coming from, I just don't agree. But perhaps that average guy, hockey mom-schtick just works on me.

I found the debate close but more in Palin's favor. I think the early "spin" is too early to be believed.

Biden did a great job, but I prefered Palin.

But you prefer Palin on the substance (such as it is). You like her tax policies or whatever, so when she says yay for tax cuts, and Biden says no we gotta tax the rich, you say: I like Palin better.

But to say that Palin got the better of Biden in that debate requires semantic gymnastics that end up just annihilating the meaningfulness of the original question. I am more than prepared to think that "my guy" got beaten. My initial reaction to the first debate was that McCain won.

She didn't answer the questions. She didn't give anything even approaching a specific. Her attacks were superficial and hackneyed ("white flag of surrender"). Basically all she did was recite a random collection of catch phrases. There was just nothing there. I don't agree with conservative ideas, but I have seen them argued for well. She not only did not do that, she didn't even try to do that. She just winked a lot, and tried to play it cute.

Seems we have the ole..."definition of what is, is, moment here" To say which side won by a show of hands at either CNN or CBS is at best laughable but... Who won? Undeniably Biden was more the attack dog, distorting, flipping,
flopping and generally pretending to be anything but a 36 yr member of the senate. Palin on the other hand was not.....well... Biden. If Ezra wants to base his conclusion on specious hand raising and his vast experience as an actual adult...24?.... already Ezra?..lol...then so be it. Real adults, not the ones having to be bussed to voting places, or letting their ponytails grow below their earring or even sitting in the stretch limo eating arugula salad for brunch saw Biden for who he is and by association say Obama as well.

Seems we have the ole..."definition of what is, is, moment here" To say which side won by a show of hands at either CNN or CBS is at best laughable but... Who won? Undeniably Biden was more the attack dog, distorting, flipping,
flopping and generally pretending to be anything but a 36 yr member of the senate. Palin on the other hand was not.....well... Biden. If Ezra wants to base his conclusion on specious hand raising and his vast experience as an actual adult...24?.... already Ezra?..lol...then so be it. Real adults, not the ones having to be bussed to voting places, or letting their ponytails grow below their earring or even sitting in the stretch limo eating arugula salad for brunch, real adults, saw Biden for who he is and by association saw Obama as well.

Kevin, you're a smart egg. But did you really respond to all that winking and smirking -- exactly the kind of thing a beauty queen would do to curry favor?

And if Palin wwants government out of the way, who's going to be fighting all those wars that the GOP clamors for?

Who pays, Kevin? Joe Six Pack?

She was an embarassment.

Real adults

Says the guy whose website is called "Dartagnan's Blade."

"who's going to be fighting all those wars that the GOP clamors for?"

This is a real question from an adult?

And the website? Your point is?

Obiden is 2-0 because people who watched CNN and CBS said so....is that the gist of the argument?

Obiden is weak....he voiced opposition to the war in Iraq because it was a convenient way to gain support for himself. I am reminded of a certain senator from The Spirit of America who decried the war only after it became apparent his distain would help him along in his future political career.

The idiots on both sides are to blame for failed energy poilcy.

McCain voted against the crap Obiden spouted because the asses can't write a bill without sticking some additional goodies onto it which have exactly zero to do with the original bill....see current bailout.

No gay marriage huh? What a freakin copout from Obiden. Two adults should be able to get married if they so choose.

Education has been controlled by fringe uber leftists for as long as I can remember. And it is Bush's fault the morons can't read?....lol

Palin won because she is not Biden....
McCain won because conservatives hate him and always have.....

Where is Perot when you need him?

"even sitting in the stretch limo eating arugula salad for brunch"

Or wearing $500 shoes like McCain!